Quantcast
Channel: Le Havre | BoardGameGeek
Viewing all 5582 articles
Browse latest View live

Reply: Le Havre:: News:: Re: Le Havre Computer Game

$
0
0

by Briguy_12

Tried a couple of games with friends last weekend via remobo, the connection was stable enough although we encountered a few bugs when taking back a turn, and paying off a loan during an opponents turn.. anyone else had this?

Reply: Le Havre:: Rules:: Re: Rules tweak for loans in newer editions from Uwe

$
0
0

by bop517

rahdo wrote:

Wow. I clearly misread the rules, and my wife and I have been playing 2p for the last half year (probably around 9 games in total) in the way that seems "logical" to us... where you have to pay 1 franc interest for each and every loan you've got out. So we generally never go over 2 or 3 loans, and pay them off as quickly as we can.

I suppose we should try the "proper rules", but this "1 franc to cover all loans" sounds crazy overpowered to us, considering we're used to playing something that is a bit more "like real life", and we like the challenge level where it's a big risk to take loans. Under what circumstances would you NOT just ignore food and take loan after loan after loan with this system. That just feels insanely overpowered, to the point where if you're not swimming in loans, you're playing the game "wrong"

We generally score in the low to mid 200's btw. The game we just finished this evening ended 259 to 247.

Will have to give some thought as to whether we'll start playing "correctly", but I worry it will so weaken the core challenge of the game to largely ignore food, and blithely carry 10 or 12 loans at a time that we'll lose a lot of our love for the game... :soblue:


Wow. We did the same as you (just played this past weekend). You had to pay a buck for each loan at interest time. Also, apparently, missed the rule where you could only take loans when you were forced to. We had always played you can take a loan when you want (to purchase). I couldn't get out of the cycle once I took two loans to get a special building to benefit me during the game. Never had anyone go hog wild on loans. I'm still under the assumption that if you have them at the game, you subtract 7 from your final total for each loan.

Reply: Le Havre:: Rules:: Re: Max number of loans

$
0
0

by Knightwizard3

Technically speaking, there is a limit on the number of loans you could take. The number would be limited by the amount of food you need to pay plus whatever loans taken for not being able to pay interest. It would make a somewhat challenging puzzle to figure out what the theoretical maximum number is, but I doubt I'll have the time to work it out...

Reply: Le Havre:: Rules:: Re: Max number of loans

$
0
0

by Ponton

Without going into much detail, the maximum number of loans ever needed would be:

[total number of turns]
+ [total number of rounds]-1
+ [total food requirement]
- [number of turns until first special building enters the game]


Reasoning:
a) Once you are in the Dive bar, it might be bought and/or sold each turn forcing you to pay 2 or 4 francs (1 loan per turn when this first happens and it can't happen until the first special building enters the game).

b) You can't have any loans in round 1, but then you may not be able to pay interest on every subsequent round.

c) You might not be able to pay the food requirement ever.

This is the maximum number of loans possible. The actual maximum might be less than this (as it might be impossible to have such a "bad course" of the game).

Reply: Le Havre:: Sessions:: Re: Le havre solo play special buildings 703 points

$
0
0

by balzi

wow, that's the way to do it.. :)

One question though from a newbie (and my game isn't in front of me), why would you keep selling the Shipping Line and buying it again? Didn't look like a profitable business deal to me.

Reply: Le Havre:: Sessions:: Re: Le havre solo play special buildings 703 points

$
0
0

by Ponton

balzi wrote:

wow, that's the way to do it.. :)

One question though from a newbie (and my game isn't in front of me), why would you keep selling the Shipping Line and buying it again? Didn't look like a profitable business deal to me.


It's the only way he could use it several times in a row. You cannot re-enter a building that you are currently sitting in. So, you must sell or buy it to free it from you, then you can re-visit it.

A Visit from a Spaceman and Some Old Friends

$
0
0

by Loofish

A little recap of some recent gaming.

The Spaceman of the title is my friend Mike, who will soon be taking up a post on the west coast doing some research for NASA. I knew he was way into astronomy but that is taking your hobby to the next level. Anyway, he is around for the rest of the month so I got him to come over for pizza and games.

In response to the inevitable question, he said "Teach me something new."

The game I taught was Louis XIV, Rudiger Dorn's area majority game, wherein you influence the nobles of the Sun King's court and peddle that influence into successful missions, which give you further abilities to influence and intrigue. I got a good jump on the Coats of Arms (which are single points) while keeping up with Missions (worth 5). My wife used her cards well to make sure she was placing last in most of the rounds (a clear advantage), while I never placed last. Plus things did not do well for me as the chits I got to cash in for missions did not match the missions I held. Meanwhile Mike was going gangbusters, completing a hard level mission in both first and second rounds (the missions have difficulty, with the easiest more readily assembled but with a lesser ability once complete, the hardest require a pair of particular mission chits, but give the best reward). However, things turned my way in the second half, making up ground in round 3 and indeed completing an 8th mission in the final round, while my wife and Mike managed only 7. The battle over the extra points was brief, my rather impressive income meaning no one was likely to overcome my lead at this point and this proved to be the case. Mike came in a creditable 2nd place and perhaps would have won if that start had combined with a little more experience in the game and how it all comes together.

For the second game, he wanted something he knew and it seemed appropriate to make that science-fiction related. And so Race for the Galaxy was the obvious call. Mike really loves this game, but as it has not attained universal acceptance in our group, it hasn't been played quite as much as Mike would like. So I stripped out the latter expansions, and we played the base game plus The Gathering Storm. I was Doomed World but had a good destination in hand (Distant World) and then drew into Spice world so I was trading blue goods for 7 cards. This transitioned into a diverse economy blend and a nice mix of card flow and consuming. Mike (Epsilon Eridani) too had a produce consume engine going, though he had less cards building up, he had good ones. My wife was New Sparta and got a nice effective military machine working, with the feared Improved Logistics as well, but then fared badly in finding good worlds to conquer. Rebel Base was her highlight and I don't think she double-built once. In the end, Mike's relentless produce/consume overcame my larger tableau by a combination of sheer VPs and a very nice New Economy (no 6-point development came my way that I liked). It is a funny thing, but Mike has way less plays of Race than either my wife or I but has a very good win percentage.

Saturday saw the return of HeroQuest, with me guiding my two kids through the scenarios in the book. We were up to Quest 10: Castle of Mystery (make sure you say that with appropriate spooky voice). This is a fun scenario where the characters get teleported around, facing different monsters alone rather than as a group. The look on my eldest son's face when he found the 5,000 gold he had found was not real was priceless.

I also played 2 games with my wife. One is an old friend, San Juan. While I prefer, Race for the Galaxy generally, this is good for a more relaxed game, good if you have just spent a while, to take a purely random example, tackling the 6 foot high grass in the back yard. There was a moment, which seems to come every game of San Juan now, when my wife looks at me and asks tentatively if we are playing with the Library today. Clearly, she had one and wanted to know if she could spend it without remorse. This play I looked at my hand and saw the other two Libraries and said, "let's play with them today." So we did and I'd almost forgotten how much they super-charge the game. She had good quality goods producing and selling, I had the prefecture, carpenter, quarry going - almost classic Guild Hall against City Hall. What gives City Hall the edge is the VP value of things like the Statue and Hero and though we both scored mightily, that was gave me the edge here too.

The other was a relatively new one, which I got in trade earlier this year. Homesteaders is a game I don't quite get yet. It is always such a struggle to get things done, let alone efficiently and with only 8 rounds you can't waste time. My wife has gotten further in this process than me though. While we both racked up debt setting things up, she got the Bank to pay it down again slowly. My River Port/Gold Mine experiment netted a lot of gold, and I didn't suffer too badly due to a lack of workers, but I did get a lot of debt and was very hampered late game in my quest to pay it down. Meanwhile, my wife was rolling in money and goods.

In a way, this is a good game for us, as she gets it better than me, so she can win (she likes winning) and I get to wrestle with the system (I like playing). We had that relationship with Caylus for a while, where I would try stuff and she would win. But eventually my experiments bore fruit (that is to say, I stopped mucking about and did what she did) and it became a lot closer.

I also wanted to mention picking up Le Havre on iOS (which makes it Le Havre (The Harbor) rather than the board game but almost the same). I love being able to rattle through a game against even 4 opponents at a rapid pace and as they are, by all accounts, about as good at the game as me (or even worse?) we all have a good time. I am also immensely impressed about how well it works on my iPod Touch's tiny screen, given how much information there is to give out in Le Havre. When I asked my wife about buying it, we both thought back to the 2 or 3 games we played in real life. Our first game (3 player) took 5 hours, which was fine even if that meant going to bed at 3am. Our second game (also 3-p), now we knew how to play it, somehow also took 5 hours. A third game (just the two of us) was shorter. But my wife's burning memory was of saying how great it would be if there was a computer taking care of all these fiddly little bits. I do wonder why she let me buy Ora et Labora and even asked to play it recently. Anyway, she liked Le Havre much better on iOS unsurprisingly, though we have to now play each other and see if that preference remains.

Reply: Le Havre:: Reviews:: Re: Don't Give Up on Le Havre - An Evolving Experience

$
0
0

by Opie

Bendalf wrote:

Zark wrote:

It takes a few plays to get used to how the buildings interact before you can start on the nuances of strategy.


This is what I failed to understand over the first 3 plays. I traded away the game because the most of the games went like this: (Get fish go to the smoke house. Get cattle, go to the abottoir. Get frustrated because you can barely buy wooden ships. Conclude the game is broken because who can ever do the thing necessary to make steel to make a steel ship let a lone a luxury liner).


This problem is only compounded when your only experience with Le Havre is 5p games. You might as well be a blindfolded monkey throwing darts from 500m.

Session: Le Havre:: Le havre solo play special buildings +580 points

$
0
0

by civ417

special buildings Fish restaurant Labour exchange Hunting Lodge
Proposal buildings order
8 3 1
16 5 10
18 7 12
22 9 14
25 23 20

f--fish
sf--smokedfish


ships supply order
w/clay w/franc w/fish w/cattle fish/grain fish/clay Iron/franc

Round 1 5francs 1coal
1.1 take 2clay offer
1.2 take 3francs offer
1.3 take 3f offer
1.4 take woods offer
1.5 construction firm(-2francs)(fishery,smokehouse)(2clay,3woods)
1.6 fishery(5f)
1.7 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
paid to feed (-5francs) special buildings Fish restaurant

Round 2 4francs 6sf 2f 1coal 2woods
2.1 fishery(5f)
2.2 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
buy Fish restaurant(-6francs)
2.3 fishery(7f)
2.4 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
2.5 fish restaurant(18sf--54francs)
buy building firm(-4francs)
buy shipping line(-10francs)
buy colliery(-10francs)
buy wooden ship(2)(-14francs)
=-38francs
2.6 fishery(7f)
2.7 colliery(4coal)
paid to feed(-5francs) city build marketplace

Round 3 1francs coal 9f
3.1 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1 coal energy--3francs)
3.2 fishery(7f)
3.3 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1 coal energy--3francs)
3.4 fishery(7f)
3.5 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1 coal energy--3francs)
3.6 Fish restaurant(18sf--54francs)
buy building firm(-6francs)
buy construction firm(-8francs)
buy Ironworks(-12francs)
buy wooden ship(4)(-14francs)
=-40francs
3.7 fishery(7f)
paid to feed(-5f) special building Labour exchange
buy Labour exchange(-6francs)

Round 4 2coal 7f 32francs
4.1 labour exch(5f,4coal)
4.2 colliery(4coal)
4.3 Labour exch(5f,4coal)
4.4 Take 12woods offer
4.5 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
4.6 labour exch(5f,4coal)
4.7 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
buy Iron ship(6)(-20francs)
paid to feed(-3f) city builds bakehouse

Round 5 18coal 18francs 7fish 10woods 12sf
5.1 labour exch(5f,4coal)
5.2 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
5.3 labour exch(5f,4coal)
5.4 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
5.5 labour exch(5f,4coal)
5.6 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
5.7 labour exch(5f,4coal)
buy Iron ship(10)(-20francs) special building Hunting lodge
buy Hunting lodge(-6francs)

Round 6 1franc 30sf 34coal 7woods 8f
6.1 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
6.2 labour exchange(7f,coal)
6.3 smokehouse (6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
6.4 labour exchange(7f,coal)
6.5 smokehouse(6f--6sf--1wood energy--3francs)
6.6 labour exchange(7f,coal)
6.7 fish rest(48sf--144francs)
buy steel ship(16)(-30francs)
buy cokery(-18francs)

Round 7 106francs 11f 4woods 49coal
7.1 labour exch(7f,5coal)
sell labour exch(+3francs)
7.2 labour exch(6f,5coal)
buy labour exch(-6francs)
7.3 labour exch(7f,coal)
7.4 cokery(64coal--64coke--64francs)
buy steel ship(20)(-30francs)
sell shipping line(+5francs)
7.5 shipping line(-2f)(18coke--2coke energy--90francs)
buy shipping line (-10francs)
7.6 shipping line(18coke--2coke energy--90francs)
sell shipping line(+5francs)
7.7 shipping line(-2f)(18coke--2coke energy--90francs)
buy shipping line(-10francs)
last action
shipping line(3coke,11fish--1coke 2woods energy--26francs)


TOTAL 423 francs 102 buildings 58 ships =583 points









File: Le Havre:: Tableros Ayuda al Jugador

Reply: Le Havre:: Rules:: Re: Le Havre Newbie Rules Questions

$
0
0

by kenykwong2

I'm a newbie too. I would like to ask if I have 2 ships, I just want to ship some goods by one ship, do I need to pay 3 energy or 6?

Thx.

Reply: Le Havre:: Rules:: Re: Le Havre Newbie Rules Questions

$
0
0

by Ponton

You pay per ship used. If you only ship goods via one ship, you only pay 3 energy, not 6.

Session: Le Havre:: Le Havre solo play spesial buildings +890 points

$
0
0

by civ417

Special buildings zoo hunting lodge workers cottage
ships supply order
fish/clay fish/wood fish/grain franc/wood franc/iron wood/clay wood/cattle
proposal buildings order
3 1 10
8 5 14
18 7 16
22 9 20
25 12 23


Round 1 5francs 1coal
1.1 Take 2 clays offer
1.2 take 3woods offer
1.3 construction firm(-2francs)(fishery,smokehouse)(2clay,3woods)
1.4 fishery(5fish)
1.5 smokehouse(4fish--4smokefish--1coal energy--2francs)
1.6 fishery(5fish)
1.7 4 francs offer
paid to feed(2smokefisf,1franc)
special building(zoo)
buy zoo(-8francs)

Round 2 2 smokedfish 6fish 3buildings
2.1 take 6 offer fish
2.2 zoo(12fish--4francs)
2.3 fishery(6fish)
2.4 zoo(18fish--6francs)
2.5 fishery(6fish)
2.6 zoo(24fish--8francs)
2.7 fishery(6fish)
buy wooden ship(2)(-14francs)
paid to feed(2smokedfish,1franc)
city buil marketplace

Round 3 3francs 30fish 3buildings 1ship
3.1 zoo(30fish--10francs)
buy shipping line(-10francs)
3.2 fishery(7fish)
3.3 zoo(37fish--12francs)
3.4 fishery(7fish)
3.5 zoo(44fish--14francs)
3.6 fishery(7fish)
3.7 zoo(51fish--17francs)
buy wooden ship(4)(-14francs)
paid to fee(-5francs)
special buildings Hunting Lodge
buy Hunting Lodge(-6francs)

Roud 4 21francs 51fish 4buildings 2ships
4.1 fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
4.2 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish)
4.3 sell fishery(+5francs) fishery(8fish)
4.4 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish)
4.5 sell fishery(+5francs)fishery(8fish)
4.6 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish)
4.7 zoo(103fish--34francs)
buy Iron ship(6)(-20francs)
paid to feed(-3francs)
city build bakehouse

Round 5 17francs 103fish 4buildings 3ships
5.1 fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.2 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.3 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.4 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.5 take 11 fish offer
5.6 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
5.7 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
buy Iron ship(10)(-20francs)
paid to feed(-1franc)
special buildings workers cottage
buy workers cottage(-12francs)

Round 6 64francs 5buildings 4ships
6.1 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
6.2 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
6.3 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
6.4 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
6.5 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4franc)
6.6 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
6.7 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
paid to feed(-6francs)
city buil charcoal kilm

Round 7 397francs 5buildings 4ships
7.1 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
7.2 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
7.3 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
7.4 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
7.5 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo (-8francs)
7.6 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
7.7 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
paid to feed(-11francs)
Last action
zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
workers cottage zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs)

TOTAL buildings 44 ships 22 francs 826 = 892 points

Reply: Le Havre:: Sessions:: Re: Le Havre solo play spesial buildings +890 points

$
0
0

by grant5

Not to rain on your parade, but why do people keep posting these? Unless you’re going to write some commentary about why this was a particularly interesting session, or why it was so significant to you, why would anyone else care about it?

Plus, if you’re going to use buildings that are known to be overpowered in single player like the zoo, at least score millions of points like some of the others who have posted these.

New Image for Le Havre


New Image for Le Havre

Reply: Le Havre:: Sessions:: Re: Le Havre solo play spesial buildings +890 points

$
0
0

by bigGameGeek

I agree, who gives a rat's ass about this??????
Yeah sure single player is easy to score. I could use the zoo and break 1000 easy but I'm not gonna waste people's time bragging about it like I accomplished something worthwhile

Session: Le Havre:: Le Havre solo play +1000 points without expansion special buildings

$
0
0

by civ417

Special buildings zoo hunting lodge fish market
ships supply order
fish/clay fish/wood fish/grain franc/wood franc/iron wood/clay wood/cattle
proposal buildings order
3 1 10
8 5 14
18 7 16
22 9 20
25 12 23


Round 1 5francs 1coal
1.1 Take 2 clays offer
1.2 take 3woods offer
1.3 construction firm(-2francs)(fishery,smokehouse)(2clay,3woods)
1.4 fishery(5fish)
1.5 smokehouse(4fish--4smokefish--1coal energy--2francs)
1.6 fishery(5fish)
1.7 4 francs offer
paid to feed(2smokefisf,1franc)
special building(zoo)
buy zoo(-8francs)

Round 2 2 smokedfish 6fish 3buildings
2.1 take 6 offer fish
2.2 zoo(12fish--4francs)
2.3 fishery(6fish)
2.4 zoo(18fish--6francs)
2.5 fishery(6fish)
2.6 zoo(24fish--8francs)
2.7 fishery(6fish)
buy wooden ship(2)(-14francs)
paid to feed(2smokedfish,1franc)
city buil marketplace

Round 3 3francs 30fish 3buildings 1ship
3.1 zoo(30fish--10francs)
buy shipping line(-10francs)
3.2 fishery(7fish)
3.3 zoo(37fish--12francs)
3.4 fishery(7fish)
3.5 zoo(44fish--14francs)
3.6 fishery(7fish)
3.7 zoo(51fish--17francs)
buy wooden ship(4)(-14francs)
paid to fee(-5francs)
special buildings Hunting Lodge
buy Hunting Lodge(-6francs)

Roud 4 21francs 51fish 4buildings 2ships
4.1 fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
4.2 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish)
4.3 sell fishery(+5francs) fishery(8fish)
4.4 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish)
4.5 sell fishery(+5francs)fishery(8fish)
4.6 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish)
4.7 zoo(103fish--34francs)
buy Iron ship(6)(-20francs)
paid to feed(-3francs)
city build bakehouse

Round 5 17francs 103fish 4buildings 3ships
5.1 fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.2 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.3 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.4 buy fishery(-10francs)fishery(9fish) sell fishery(+5francs)
5.5 take 11 fish offer
5.6 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
5.7 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
buy Iron ship(10)(-20francs)
paid to feed(-1franc)
special buildings fish market
buy fish market(-4francs)

Round 6 72francs 5buildings 4ships
6.1 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
6.2 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
6.3 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
6.4 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
6.5 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4franc)
6.6 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
6.7 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
paid to feed(-6francs)
city buil charcoal kilm

Round 7 405francs 5buildings 4ships
7.1 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
7.2 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
7.3 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
7.4 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
7.5 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo (-8francs)
7.6 zoo(150fish--50francs) sell zoo(+4francs)
7.7 zoo(-1franc)(150fish--50francs) buy zoo(-8francs)
paid to feed(-11francs)
Last action
fish market(150fish--300francs)


TOTAL buildings 44 ships 22 francs 1020 = 1086 points

Reply: Le Havre:: Sessions:: Re: Le Havre solo play +1000 points without expansion special buildings

$
0
0

by grant5

Ok, seriously? Another one the very next day? Write something interesting about the session or else NO ONE CARES. Nobody is going to read through your game log text dump. Plus you see the Zoo first thing and it's like, "oh, another guy scored a bunch of solo points with the Zoo. Yawn."

If you're just posting these to keep a record for your own benefit, then for god's sake post them as replies to one of your existing threads. Stop creating new threads, it's obnoxious to everyone who is subscribed to Le Havre, and I suspect that is a lot of people.

Reply: Le Havre:: Sessions:: Re: Le Havre solo play +1000 points without expansion special buildings

$
0
0

by Sapper_SB

grant5 wrote:

Ok, seriously? Another one the very next day? Write something interesting about the session or else NO ONE CARES. Nobody is going to read through your game log text dump. Plus you see the Zoo first thing and it's like, "oh, another guy scored a bunch of solo points with the Zoo. Yawn."

If you're just posting these to keep a record for your own benefit, then for god's sake post them as replies to one of your existing threads. Stop creating new threads, it's obnoxious to everyone who is subscribed to Le Havre, and I suspect that is a lot of people.


Amen. Or, create a geeklist with Le Havre on it and post sessions in the comment area (this is what I do).
Viewing all 5582 articles
Browse latest View live




Latest Images