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    by stlm

    fardoche wrote:


    If you like to play football, you can buy an Xbox + Madden 13 and play online or you can play it for real with actual friends. I don't agree they provide the same type of enjoyment, but to each their own.

    However, I admit that playing the iOS version of a game is an adequate surrogate when no one is around or willing to play the cardboard version.


    We all know what you're trying to do there, but it's really not a perfect analogy. When playing Le Havre on an iPad and with cardboard at a table, in both cases your body is stationary and the movement required to play requires no more than the extension of an arm. They're really much more similar and provide a much more similar type of experience than the quite different electronic/physical football games.

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    by riastradh

    My gripe with the iOS version is that sometimes I wait for days on the match system to gather enough players. Additionally, it's not very good at pushing notifications to me unless I leave it running in the background.

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    by Anarchosyn

    UnknownParkerBrother wrote:

    Anarchosyn wrote:

    Simple question:

    When one goes to build a ship, and the type of ship they opt to build (or purchase) has multiple values present, is it down to choice as to which is adopted, or is it based more on the hierarchy/order of reveal?


    There are no "multiple values" present. The ships are in one stack, and the only ship you can build is the one you can see.


    Wow, I'm at a loss for how to reply to this. First off, there are most certainly multiple values, and the work "value" is even a game defined term (used in contrast to "cost," at least in the English language editions).

    Secondly, the stack is exactly what I'm talking about -- when the top card is valued at $2 and the card underneath is valued at $4, are you **forced** to take the top card, or can you choose any card in the pile?

    The rules appear to be silent on this, hence the post, but logic tells me you'd have to take from the top-most. However, to force a rule like this, I'd like to know where in the rules it is established.

    Normally this wouldn't be an issue, as later ships tend to have a higher value than earlier ships, but if you check the Luxury Liners in the three player game (turns 17 and 18), you'll see that the last Liner has a lower value than the penultimate one.

    Oddly enough, I'm pretty sure I just rewrote my original post in reply to your rather unhelpful commentary.

    davypi wrote:

    Anarchosyn wrote:

    .. later purchases were rewarded with a higher value due to the increased hardships implicit in acquiring a ship later than soon.


    Actually, its the opposite. Its more difficult to build them early as resources are more scarce.



    My bad, I was a touch drunk still while posting that. We're talking about the same thing; the "hardship" I found implicit was a reference to the difficulties a player would encounter feeding their people without the benefit of early ships.


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    by louper

    Steve's post was precisely correct. There are not "multiple values" present - the only value present is the one on top of the stack. You have NO choice. If you're buying, for example, a wooden ship, you must take the top one from the stack. You have no choice.

    "Multiple values" being present implies you have some kind of choice. You don't. There is only one value present. Period.

    Could the rules have been clearer? Probably.

    Could Steve have been clearer? Eh, probably not.

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    by PauloSantoro

    When you say that the commentary by Steve Duff was "rather unhelpful", you are being rather ungrateful. He wrote exactly what you should know about the question you've asked. David Jones was also very helpful.

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    by Anarchosyn

    louper wrote:

    Steve's post was precisely correct. There are not "multiple values" present - the only value present is the one on top of the stack. You have NO choice. If you're buying, for example, a wooden ship, you must take the top one from the stack. You have no choice.

    "Multiple values" being present implies you have some kind of choice. You don't. There is only one value present. Period.

    Could the rules have been clearer? Probably.

    Could Steve have been clearer? Eh, probably not.


    ... but they are present, as in physically present. It has nothing to do with a choice, by implicit character. It has everything to do with multiple values being physically present in front of all the players.

    As to Steve being unhelpful, his post was terse and unfriendly. He neither answered my question, nor explained where in the rules his interpretation stemmed.

    In fact, I'm still unsure where you guys are getting this from. Is it explicitly stated somewhere?

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    by DavidT

    I think you may be misinterpreting "concise" and "accurate" as "terse" and "unfriendly." Steve definitively answered your question.

    Since you require more, see the rules, p.6:

    Only the topmost face-up card on each ship pile may be purchased.

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    by Gonjeshk

    davypi wrote:

    The reason for the point differential has to do with the food reward. Assume a 3P game. A wooden ship acquired on round 4 will provide 15 rounds of free food - netting 45 food. A wooden ship acquired on round 6 will provide 13 rounds or 39 food which is three more food. The point differential is there to offset the fact you get less food from the boat.


    I also feel that the potential to use the boat for shipping plays a part as well. While that 10-point steel ship may not look as shiny as its 24-point counterpart, not only will it provide more food, but more potential opportunities to ship goods as well.

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    by Estarriol7

    Just wanted to say thanks for the Shire Games tip - I managed to get one before they ran out of stock. I was jumping up and down like a little girl when I opened the box! :)

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    by viddy

    DavidT wrote:

    I think you may be misinterpreting "concise" and "accurate" as "terse" and "unfriendly." Steve definitively answered your question.

    Since you require more, see the rules, p.6:

    Only the topmost face-up card on each ship pile may be purchased.


    Also, page 8:

    Finally, the Round card is turned over to show the ship on its reverse. Place it on the pile of Ship cards of that type.


    Also, in the description of the Wharf in the Buildings Overview:

    Players can only build ships that are become available (sic), and can only build the topmost ship on each pile.


    The reason multiple values are not present is because the top card renders the cards underneath it irrelevant. So, the values of the other cards are no more present than the unavailable ship cards that will be flipped over in future rounds.

    Much more importantly, and with all due respect, the level of unfriendliness you are displaying is much higher than then level that Steve displayed (if it can even be said that Steve was being unfriendly in the first place). If someone provides an answer to a question, and you don't know where in the rules they got that answer from, then you ought to try to find that information in your copy of the rules before you demand validation from the person who answered your question, and you ought to consider whether you might be misinterpreting the tone of a post before you call someone "unfriendly" or "unhelpful."

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    by DrumPhil

    I haven't played the analog version yet, but really enjoy the iOS version. At some point we'll probably get the box, but for now the app was a great way to learn this great game.

    One question: now that my list of 12 previously played games is full, it looks like the only way I can start a new game is to open a previous game and request a rematch. But that doesn't let me change game settings. All my previous games were short version, and I'd like to try the long version. But I can't change the settings.

    Is there a way to clear the list of played games, so I can start a new game from scratch?

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    by riastradh

    Is there not a red X to the left of the game name that should allow you to delete existing games?

    0 0

    by DrumPhil

    riastradh wrote:

    Is there not a red X to the left of the game name that should allow you to delete existing games?


    Yes, there are red Xs, but nothing happens when I tap them.

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  • 04/04/13--11:46: New Image for Le Havre
  • by max_s

    Beginning of 2p game

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    by daveshaerf

    So i LOVE Le Havre. I think it might be my favorite game.

    I have been teaching my girlfriend the game. We have played the short 2 player game like 4 times now.

    She is getting into it, though she refuses to take loans (she has Agricola 'begging card' fear). Ergo, she spends many of her turns on acquiring food rather than building her 'empire'.

    I am sort of the opposite, I am taking out loans willy-nilly working towards generating an engine of some sort that will be able to pay loans back by the end of the game.

    My question is this: Will she ever be able to win without taking a loan out? Is it possible to win a game without taking loans when your opponent is?

    Curious to hear what people's experiences are.


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    by Thunkd

    It is entirely possible to win without taking loans. However, I don't think you should start out with the mindset that you won't take a loan. There are going to be moments in the game where you have to decide if you want to take action A and be forced to take a loan or take action B. And based on the position A may be better or B may be better. Take the better choice... don't avoid taking loans just on principle.

    That being said, if you can avoid loans, ceteris paribus, then do so.

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    by gmpearce

    I have won a few times with no loans taken, and a few times with many loans taken, but paid off by the end. As has been stated before, the route to victory will always depend on which special buildings come out and how you utilize them. If she seriously wants to take as few loans as possible, then she should be aiming at building ships, with her intended payoff being shipping line late in the game.

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    by Thunkd

    gmpearce wrote:

    If she seriously wants to take as few loans as possible, then she should be aiming at building ships, with her intended payoff being shipping line late in the game.

    The thing about coming into a game with a plan already in place is that you are ignoring what is going on in the game. Depending on turn order, which things come out in which order, what your opponents have taken, what they have left you with, etc. the plan you came in with isn't necessarily the best plan for the situation. You should look at what is going on and choose the best plan. Don't choose a plan and try to force the situation to fit what you want to do.

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    by davypi

    daveshaerf wrote:


    My question is this: Will she ever be able to win without taking a loan out? Is it possible to win a game without taking loans when your opponent is?


    Well, the biggest difficulty with a question like this is, it depends on the skill level of your opponents. I've won games without a loan, but its usually either against people I do very well against or new players.

    Having said that, the only way to win without loans is to make sure you are taking care of your upkeep with boats. The real flaw with your GFs strategy is not in refusing loans, but in the "acquiring food" mindset. My usual "no loan" wins involve building and selling the sawmill for money and then hitting the joinery. With the resulting cash, you can outright purchase a wooden boat within about seven actions and keep your upkeep under control. From there, strategy changes depending on what is available to me, but you still have to be looking towards the next boat whether you buy it or make a bee line for the wharf in the building stack. You have to have a long term strategy for dealing with upkeep, and the fish/grain/cattle solutions simply won't cut it.

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    by Thunkd

    davypi wrote:

    Having said that, the only way to win without loans is to make sure you are taking care of your upkeep with boats. The real flaw with your GFs strategy is not in refusing loans, but in the "acquiring food" mindset. My usual "no loan" wins involve building and selling the sawmill for money and then hitting the joinery. With the resulting cash, you can outright purchase a wooden boat within about seven actions and keep your upkeep under control. From there, strategy changes depending on what is available to me, but you still have to be looking towards the next boat whether you buy it or make a bee line for the wharf in the building stack. You have to have a long term strategy for dealing with upkeep, and the fish/grain/cattle solutions simply won't cut it.

    That advice is highly dependent on player count. Food pressure is a lot less with more players, so fish/grain/cattle strategies work better. You still want boats though, if no other reason than shipping.

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